Trainee solicitor question!

[Polkey]

Hi there,

I'm in the process of training to be a solicitor and was wondering if I could ask some probably rather stupid questions here?!!!

 

Once I have completed my training contract in the uk (I know I will probs have to do some retraining and studying when we come over but...) can I apply for NQ positions in Aus and work unqualified? Do companies sponsor the conversion studies so I can work unqualified whilst I convert and register in Aus?

 

any help or contact with those who have done this will be gratefully received!

Thanks

 

Julie x:biggrin:

[Rupert]

I cannot think of a visa that would allow this. Skilled migrant and employer sponsored visas are for skilled / qualified workers.

[nicolac34]

Yes you can, I have a friend who is here on a 457 working as a solicitor. The law firm is supporting her in her studies to be able to be admitted in Australia as well.

[Polkey]

Yes you can, I have a friend who is here on a 457 working as a solicitor. The law firm is supporting her in her studies to be able to be admitted in Australia as well.

 

thanks! That's all I needed to hear. Not too worried about the visa side of things was more concerned about there being a possibility that a firm would sponsor the studies where necessary.

 

Thank you for your reply x

[Guest guest73691]

Hello there.

 

I'm a England & Wales qualified lawyer working in NSW and I'm in the process of studying towards being admitted in NSW.

 

You can work over here without being admitted, you just cannot refer to yourself as a lawyer/solicitor - so you may be called a 'foreign qualified lawyer' or a 'legal advisor'. If you were to get a job with one of the larger commercial firms, then they are probably likely to be open to funding the studies you will need to do to be admitted in whichever state you are working in. What area of law do you hope to work in?

 

A few things to bear in mind:

 

1) Firstly, the process for becoming a lawyer is different over here to back in the UK, so it would not be a case of applying for an NQ position like it would be in the UK. My experience of the system here is that graduate lawyers (i.e. lawyers who have completed their law degree) are generally offered jobs with law firms following a summer clerkship (similar to a vacation scheme in the UK, but longer in duration). The alternative would be to try and look at jobs as an 'experienced' lawyer, if you have done a 2 year training contract, then that may count over here as being equivalent to 1 year PQE (different firms may have different view on this). However, it would be beneficial if you have some additional experience post-qualification under your belt to stand a greater chance of being able to get a job offer.

 

2) (As with many jobs) it is likely to be difficult to obtain employment if you are applying from the UK, as there are already a lot of Aussie qualified lawyers here who are able to interview in person. This is especially the case if you are looking at a 457 visa.

 

3) Each state has a slightly different process for requalification. E.g. in NSW the relevant body is the Legal Profession Admission Board, which assesses your qualifications/experience and tells you what it is you need to study. So you would need to look into this once you decided where in Australia you were heading.

 

4) What type of visa are you considering? Most foreign qualified lawyers I know here are working on 457 visas, unless they have an Australian partner/spouse. To pass the skills assessment as a lawyer for the purposes of a skilled independent 189 visa my understanding (having looked into it for myself) is that you need to be admitted as a lawyer in Australia.

 

MsAKW

Edited December 27, 2013 by guest73691

[Polkey]

That's so helpful, thank you very much. We have been to Aus before so I understand the issue with applying from the uk, very difficult! I am going to make a start at looking at larger firms in Aus that May have offices in London etc and start putting the feelers out

[Killara]

Hi there,

I'm in the process of training to be a solicitor and was wondering if I could ask some probably rather stupid questions here?!!!

 

Once I have completed my training contract in the uk (I know I will probs have to do some retraining and studying when we come over but...) can I apply for NQ positions in Aus and work unqualified? Do companies sponsor the conversion studies so I can work unqualified whilst I convert and register in Aus?

 

any help or contact with those who have done this will be gratefully received!

Thanks

 

 

I did this also, but I did have four years of prior experience as a lawyer prior to arriving in Australia. I don't mean to dampen your hopes, but if all you will have done is completed your training in the UK, then I think you will find it difficult to find an employer who is both willing to sponsor you and to pay for your re-qualification in Australia... Simply because as opposed to the Australian law graduate, they would prefer the Australian law graduate to a UK graduate with no real experience post-qualification, and there are heaps of Australian law graduates without jobs. There is a lot of competition even among Australian law graduates for positions in law firms. I know people looking to do the same as you, but they have been told by recruitment agencies that there is no real prospect of them getting what they are looking for, and they are not even getting any real responses from law firms. If you can go to Australia and start the re-qualification process, you should be able to get a job in a law firm, which will stand you in good stead when you get admitted as an Australian lawyer, but don't expect that they will both sponsor you and pay for your re-qualification. That's a big ask, which for a solicitor from the UK with no PQE, I think unlikely to be able to get in Australia. Sorry. But don't let that dissuade you from pursuing your plan to re-qualify in Australia. If you want to live and work in Australia, it is a move definitely worth making, and for me, definitely was the right move yo make. I wish you every success.

[Polkey]

Thanks for your post! I realise it's going to be stiff competition, much as it is in the uk too. To be honest, when I was talking about sponsorship I was meaning for the retraining, not for the visa. I'm in a lucky position that my oh has a job/skill that will easily allow us a visa. I'm wanting to know the nitty gritty about how you go about the retraining and whether it's possible to work at the same time as doing it. I'm going to assess the options from this end first, we're not in any hurry and I was expecting to stay on in the uk for a wee while as PQE.

thanks for you help and advice x

[Guest guest73691]

If you were unable to find a job as a lawyer straight away, you could work doing something else while you do the required studies - I know a lot of people doing this. It would be easier to get a job once admitted. This does mean you would have to self fund the study. If you have an English law degree + LPC then you could probably finish this in a year or so. If you don't have a law degree then you will probably be required to study a lot more subjects , so that would take longer and be more expensive. Maybe look into how much study you are likely to be required to do and work on the basis you may have to self fund it. Then if you get a firm to pay for it, it will be a bonus. I reckon the fees for my required studies (including paying to have quals assessed etc) will end up being about $5,000. In NSW the assessing body also runs a course you can take where the fees are lower than at a normal university. Not sure what the position is in other states.

[Polkey]

If you were unable to find a job as a lawyer straight away, you could work doing something else while you do the required studies - I know a lot of people doing this. It would be easier to get a job once admitted. This does mean you would have to self fund the study. If you have an English law degree + LPC then you could probably finish this in a year or so. If you don't have a law degree then you will probably be required to study a lot more subjects , so that would take longer and be more expensive. Maybe look into how much study you are likely to be required to do and work on the basis you may have to self fund it. Then if you get a firm to pay for it, it will be a bonus. I reckon the fees for my required studies (including paying to have quals assessed etc) will end up being about $5,000. In NSW the assessing body also runs a course you can take where the fees are lower than at a normal university. Not sure what the position is in other states.

 

Thanks for telling me your experiences! It really does help when you have 1st hand information. I know it's a good few years away yet but better to have the long term plans/ideas in place so you know which line to take! I'll see what the other states have to offer in terms of routes for admittance and likelihood of self fund costing x

[engaus]

Thanks for telling me your experiences! It really does help when you have 1st hand information. I know it's a good few years away yet but better to have the long term plans/ideas in place so you know which line to take! I'll see what the other states have to offer in terms of routes for admittance and likelihood of self fund costing x

 

Just thought its add in my partners experience since he arrived in Australia in feb 2013. He completed his degree in the UK and had it assessed in Victoria. He was told he had to study 4 units - as an international student this amounted to approx $3000 a unit ($12,000 in total). Unless you have some extensive experience back home id say it would be next to impossible to have a employer pay for that given the amount of graduates/qualifies solicitors here. I was reading an article only last week that said it's currently the worst time in Australian history to be a graduate lawyer. Too many graduates not enough jobs..

 

In Victoria they also have a priority system for local graduates so I would do some reading on that before you get here - unless you have a good few years experience as a solicitor back home (strongly recommend that before coming out here).

Another issue we have come up against is that most firms flat out refuse to take you on unless you have local experience. Regardless of my partner having over a years experience in the UK and having completed his AUstralian units he can't seem to even get a basic legal admin job.

 

So after a year of trying to get a job my partner and I will most likely move back to the UK next year where he's been offered a position in a London firm.

 

To to says it's been a stressful 12 months is an understatement.

[Polkey]

Just thought its add in my partners experience since he arrived in Australia in feb 2013. He completed his degree in the UK and had it assessed in Victoria. He was told he had to study 4 units - as an international student this amounted to approx $3000 a unit ($12,000 in total). Unless you have some extensive experience back home id say it would be next to impossible to have a employer pay for that given the amount of graduates/qualifies solicitors here. I was reading an article only last week that said it's currently the worst time in Australian history to be a graduate lawyer. Too many graduates not enough jobs..

 

In Victoria they also have a priority system for local graduates so I would do some reading on that before you get here - unless you have a good few years experience as a solicitor back home (strongly recommend that before coming out here).

Another issue we have come up against is that most firms flat out refuse to take you on unless you have local experience. Regardless of my partner having over a years experience in the UK and having completed his AUstralian units he can't seem to even get a basic legal admin job.

 

So after a year of trying to get a job my partner and I will most likely move back to the UK next year where he's been offered a position in a London firm.

 

To to says it's been a stressful 12 months is an understatement.

 

Thanks for your sharing, I'm sorry to hear it's been so stressful for you. My husband and I tried a couple of years ago to settle in Queensland but just couldn't find work (I wasn't a law student then though) and we just had to call it quits. You go over all guns blazing having prepared to give it everything you have BUT sometimes it just doesn't work out . Thanks for telling me your experience, it really does help when you are armed with all the possibilities. I know it's going to be a good few years yet before we can contemplate making the move, and it might jog even be to Aus but just assessing the options.

 

hope it all works out for you and your partner. Take deep breaths and go with the flow. You've lived and experienced more in the last 12 months than some will in a lifetime, it's all good

[Man from Snowy Mountain]

hi, i have UK law degree but i never set a day of my foot on UK soil getting the law degree. i am living and working in HK (I am Chinese btw) and I am Australian Citizen but i left Oz 20 yrs ago. now i almost finish the LPAB's academic subjects going into PLT but after PLT and after NSW admission, can I get the practising cert to practise Aussie law in HK? pls advise. thx.

[Man from Snowy Mountain]

what is the pay like as a lawyer in London? my law degree is from UK which means i can practise law in UK after LPC. i am chinese working and living in HK. i am trying to compare the law salary across UK, HK and Australia. thx.